Report to the Senate
Introduction
1. On
9 May 2007, the Senate referred to the committee for examination and report the
following documents:
- Particulars of certain proposed expenditure in respect of the
year ending 30 June 2008 relating to the Defence portfolio and the Foreign
Affairs and Trade portfolio, and
- Particulars of proposed expenditure in respect of the year ending
30 June 2008.
2. The committee has considered the proposed
budget expenditure for the year ending 30 June 2008,
and has received evidence from the Minister representing the Minister for
Foreign Affairs and the Minister for Trade; the Minister representing the Minister
for Defence,
and the Minister for Veterans’ Affairs; and officers of the departments and
agencies concerned.
3. The
committee met in public session on 28, 29, 30 and 31 May 2007. Further written
explanations provided by departments and agencies will be presented separately
in volumes of additional information. This information will also be placed on
the committee’s internet site (www.aph.gov.au/senate_fadt).
Questions on notice
4.
The committee resolved, under
Standing Order 26, that written answers and additional information should be
submitted to the committee by close of business on Thursday, 26 July 2007.
Foreign Affairs and Trade portfolio
Department of Foreign Affairs and
Trade
Changes to output structure
5. The
committee notes that the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade has recently
undergone a structural reorganisation in Outcome 1. Mr Doug Chester, Deputy Secretary, advised that 'the department did a
reorganisation of divisions late last year and, as a result of that
reorganisation, responsibility for various geographic areas was separated and
realigned'.[1]
This has resulted in changes to the numbering of the following outputs:
Department
of Foreign Affairs and Trade |
Outcome 1
|
Previous
|
Current
|
Output
1.1
|
Protection and advocacy of Australia's
international interests through the provision of policy advice to ministers
and overseas diplomatic activity
|
No change
|
Output
1.1.1
|
North Asia
|
No change
|
Output
1.1.2
|
South and South–East Asia
|
South–East Asia
|
Output
1.1.3
|
Americas and Europe
|
Americas
|
Output
1.1.4
|
South Pacific, Middle East and Africa
|
Europe
|
Output
1.1.5
|
Bilateral, regional and multi-lateral trade
negotiations
|
South and West Asia, Middle East and Africa
|
Output
1.1.6
|
Trade development/policy coordination and
Asia–Pacific Economic Cooperation
|
Pacific
|
Output
1.1.7
|
International organisations, legal and
environment
|
Bilateral, regional and multi-lateral trade
negotiations
|
Output
1.1.8
|
Security, nuclear disarmament and non–proliferation
|
Trade development/policy coordination and
Asia–Pacific Economic Cooperation
|
Output
1.1.9
|
–
|
International organisations, legal and
environment
|
Output
1.1.10
|
–
|
Security, nuclear disarmament and non–proliferation
|
6. The
committee acknowledged the attendance at the hearings of Mr Doug Chester, Deputy Secretary, and officers of the Department of
Foreign Affairs and Trade.[2]
Late answers to questions on notice
7. The
Department
of Foreign Affairs and Trade was asked about the late response to the 80
questions taken on notice during the last estimates hearings in February 2007.
The department informed the committee that no question had been answered by the
required date of 29 March 2007 set down by the committee.
8. Mr
Chester stated that 68 answers were submitted to the Minister's office on 26
March (and approved on 17 April). The remaining 12 were submitted on 29 March
(and approved on 8 May, apart from one answer that was amended). Of these
answers, 79 were provided to the committee secretariat in one batch on 8 May,
with the final answer provided on 23 May.[3]
9. The
committee sought an explanation for the delay in submitting the answers to the
committee following approval by the Minister on 17 April. Mr Chester took
the question on notice.[4]
10. Other matters raised during the hearing are listed below.
Portfolio
overview[5]
- Change in the numbering of outputs
due to a reorganisation of divisions within the department (pp. 4–5, 28 May 2007).
Output 1.1
1.1.1—North Asia
- Asia–Pacific security arrangements
(pp. 6–7).
- Six–party talks on North Korea (pp. 8–9 and 10); DFAT delegation to Pyongyang in March (p. 10).
- Prime Minister's visit to Japan and the
issue of comfort women (pp. 9–10).
- DFAT involvement in the Dalai
Lama's pending visit, including representations from China (pp. 10–11).
- Update on allegations of organ
harvesting in China (pp. 11–12);
Beijing Olympic Games and human rights
concerns (p. 13); update on human rights dialogue with China (pp. 13–14).
1.1.2—South East Asia
- Burma's decision not to change the
status of Aung San Suu Kyi's detention and house arrest; Australia's response; construction
of a nuclear facility in Burma (p. 14).
- Complaint from a constituent about
an incident in Cambodia relating to a motorcade of cars (pp. 14–16).
- Mr Peter Ellis: DFAT's role in the handling of the case (pp. 16–27). [Also relates to output 1.1.9]
- East Timor: assessment of the electoral process (p. 27); Australia's long-term plans for peace building (pp. 27–28).
- Status of Australia's
diplomatic relations with Burma; restrictions on visits to Australia by
Burmese linked with the regime (pp. 28–29
and 31).
- Australian government
representations to Indonesia about human rights in West Papua (pp. 29 and 31).
- Whether there are any plans to
move the Australian embassy in Burma from Rangoon to the new capital (p. 30).
- Thailand: progress made towards the recovery of democracy;
update on the insurrection in southern Thailand (p. 30).
-
Australia's participation in counterterrorism activity in the Philippines (p. 31).
- Regional interfaith dialogue: aims
and participants (pp. 32–33).
1.1.3—Americas
- Discussions between Australia and
the United States about the arrest of protestors at Pine Gap military
base (pp. 33–34 and 63).
1.1.4—Europe
-
Appointment of new
ambassador-designate to Italy (pp.34–52).
-
Russia: President Putin's proposal
for a moratorium on the treaty on conventional forces in Europe (p.52); media
reports about the beating of Australian born gay rights activist, Peter
Tatchell, and others at a gay pride march (pp.52–53).
-
France: election of new President; Australia's
relationship with Mr Sarkozy and members of his cabinet (p.53).
-
Croatia: guidance to DFAT officers about the Croatian
nationalist organisation, Ustasha (pp.53–54);
Senator Coonan's attendance at a
Croatian independence function and subsequent statement to SBS radio (p.54).
-
Former Senator Jim Short's
appointment and duties as Special Envoy for Cyprus (pp.54–55).
1.1.5—South and West Asia, Middle East and Africa
-
Zimbabwe: update on human rights
situation and living standards (pp.55–56);
maintaining of diplomatic relations (pp.56–57); sanctions,
including travel and financial restrictions (pp.57–59); Australian interests in Zimbabwe (pp.59 and 63).
-
Update on the situation in Iraq (pp.60–78), including:
Australian government representations to the Iraqi government; Australia's contribution
to the reconciliation effort (p.60);
measurement of civilian casualties in Iraq (pp.60–61 and 71–73); hydrocarbons legislation (pp.70–71 and 74–75); developments in establishing enforceable legal
systems (pp.73–74); reconstruction efforts, International Compact with
Iraq, and International Reconstruction Fund Facility (pp.74–76);
troop surge (p.77); petition by members of the Iraqi parliament for a
timetable for withdrawal of foreign troops (pp.77–78).
-
DFAT's involvement in act of grace
payments for civilian casualties involving Australian forces (pp.61–62).
-
Operating costs for the Australian
embassy in Baghdad (pp.62–64).
-
Update on AFP investigation into
seven alleged breaches of UN sanctions on imports from Iraq (pp.64–68).
-
Intelligence sharing on Iraq with the United States (pp.68–70 and 76).
-
Funding of mosque in Adelaide by
the Saudi Arabian Government (p.77).
1.1.6—Pacific[6]
-
PNG: ministerial-level contact
between Australian and PNG governments; update on the Julian Moti case; delay
in deployment of Australian police advisers; Australian civilian advisers
involved in the Enhanced Cooperation Program (pp.4–5, 29 May 2007).
-
Solomon Islands: open letter from
Mr Downer
to the Solomon Islands people; requirement for ministerial approval for visa
exemptions for RAMSI personnel; current level of contact between Solomon Islands
government and RAMSI staff; decision not to rearm the police; review of RAMSI
by the Pacific Islands Forum (pp.5–8
and 18).
-
Evacuation of the Carteret Islands population
to Bougainville due to the rising sea level (p.8).
-
Requests by Pacific Island nations
to make arrangements for their populations to come to Australia in
the event of climate change/rising sea levels; planning by DFAT on the impact
of people movement in the Pacific due to climate change (pp.8–10).
-
Status of our financial
relationship with Nauru; MOU with Nauru (pp.10–14
and 59).
-
Fiji: update on measures taken by
the Australian government after the coup; Pacific Islands Forum Fiji Joint
Working Group on the Situation in Fiji; election timetable; Fiji Human Rights
Commission (pp.14–17 and 59).
-
DFAT's assessment of the situation
in Tonga; aid to assist businesses to recover from damage caused in the riots (pp.17–18 and 59).
1.1.7—Bilateral, regional and multi–lateral trade
negotiations, and
1.1.8—Trade development /policy coordination and APEC
-
Australia–China free trade
agreement (FTA) negotiations (pp.103–104,
113, and 114–116).
-
WTO: Doha round (pp.104–108).
-
WTO dispute processes initiated by
the Philippines in relation to Australian quarantine (pp.108–109).
-
Concerns regarding BSE and imports
of US beef to Australia (pp.109–111).
-
Structure of FTA negotiating teams
and staffing (pp.111–112).
-
Gulf Cooperation Council FTA (pp.112–113).
-
Japan FTA (pp.113–114).
-
ASEAN FTA (pp.116–117).
-
Chile FTA (p.117).
-
Malaysia FTA (p.117).
-
US FTA: review of implementation (pp.117–118).
-
Impact of Australian elections on
FTA negotiations (pp.118–119).
-
APEC meeting – agenda and
priorities (pp.119–120).
1.1.9—International organisations, legal and environment
-
Update on Mr Trent Smith's case,
including issues relating to Mr Hyndes, witness before the Industrial Relations Commission (pp.18–53).
-
Update on DFAT's involvement in
the case of Mr David Hicks (pp.53–56
and 59); MOU relating to Mr Hicks' return
and ongoing conditions (p.60).
-
Australian government's current
view on the Guantanamo Bay facility (pp.56–59).
-
Mutual assistance arrangement with
the United States in relation to exchanging refugees (pp.61–62).
-
Sri Lankan asylum seekers—DFAT
discussions with Indonesian, Sri Lankan and Nauru governments (pp.62–63).
1.1.10—Security, nuclear disarmament and non–proliferation
-
Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG);
whether NSG should authorise the provision of uranium to India; current
Australian policy on the sale of uranium to India (pp.63–65
and 67).
-
Australia's participation in the Generation IV advanced nuclear
research reactor program (pp.65–66).
-
Global Nuclear Energy Partnership (pp.66–67).
-
Australian government's position
on the proposed international treaty to ban cluster munitions (pp.67–69).
-
International initiative to
address the threat posed by Man Portable Air Defence Systems (MANPADS) (pp.69–70).
-
DFAT's involvement in planning for
a possible avian influenza outbreak (p.70).
-
Taiwan's possible participation in World Health Organisation
activities (p.70).
11. The
committee acknowledged the attendance at the hearings of Mr Bruce Davis, Director General, and officers representing AusAID.
12. Matters
raised by the committee included:
-
Budget outlays for this year and
the next three forward years (pp.80–86
and 110, 28May 2007).
-
OECD Development Assistance
Committee (DAC) guidelines on the definition of aid (pp.87–89 and 94).
-
Sydney Morning Herald article about aid and related issues. Iraq debt
relief; DAC guidelines for debt relief; debt relief for other countries;
payment to legal firm Sparke Helmore for legal assistance during the Cole
inquiry (pp.90–98).
-
Mr Charles Tapp's employment with AusAID (pp.98–99).
-
NGO input into the formulation of
aid policy (p.99).
-
Removal of charitable status from
AID/WATCH by the ATO (pp.99 and 100).
-
AusAID's policy on
aid to the Burmese Government (pp.99–100).
-
Deforestation initiative (pp.100–101 and 110–115).
-
Decision making at the World Bank
in relation to Paul Wolfowitz (p.102).
-
Funding for sexual and
reproductive health programs; contraception programs; whether there are
conflicts between the AusAID family planning guidelines and the AusAID white
paper; review of family planning guidelines (pp.102–105).
-
Programs to reduce maternal
mortality rates associated with pregnancy and childbirth (pp.105–106 and 109).
-
Integration of sexual and
reproductive health and HIV/AIDS issues; funding for HIV/AIDS program in Papua
New Guinea; ODE/PNG government impact evaluation of HIV programs in Papua
New Guinea (pp.106–109).
-
AusAID support for the
International AIDS Society conference in Sydney in July 2007 (pp.115–116).
-
Capacity building in the Pacific
and Asia (pp.117–120).
-
Bilateral emergency funding (pp.120–122).
-
Staffing and accommodation (pp.122–127).
Austrade[8]
13. The
committee acknowledged the attendance at the hearings of Mr Peter Yuile, Deputy Chief
Executive Officer, and officers representing Austrade.
14. Matters
raised by the committee included:
-
Enhancing Australia's
commercial engagement program; India program (pp.71–72
and 88, 29 May 2007).
-
Staffing levels and location of
staff (pp.72–76 and 88).
-
Number of Australian companies
exporting; number of exporters assisted by Austrade (pp.76–79 and 88).
-
Performance measurement, including
key performance indicators (KPIs) (pp.79–88
and 94).
-
Export market development grants
(EMDG) scheme (pp.88–94).
-
Australian government's Global
integration statement; funding for Global opportunities program (pp.94–99).
-
Business Club program events (pp.99–102).
Defence portfolio
Department of Defence
Pre-estimates briefing on the
Portfolio Budget Statement and Annual Report
15. Committee members attended a private briefing from Defence
officers responsible for the PBS and Annual Report to gain a better
understanding of these documents, their structure and outputs, the location and
explanation of the various tables contained in the PBS and to determine a
schedule and order for asking questions. The committee takes this opportunity
to thank Defence for their assistance and willingness to assist the committee.
Proposed changes to the Department
of Defence's Output structure
16. During this
briefing, the committee was advised of proposed changes to Defence's
outcome and output structure. The changes are outlined in the PBS.
17. During the
hearing, a defence witness explained that the proposed changes were noted in
the PBS to flag that Defence would have a new outcome structure which has
been agreed to by the Minister for Finance and Administration. He explained:
The changes were agreed too late for us to be able to translate
all of the information into this document this time around for two reasons. One
was that we did not have enough time, but the second thing was that we were
transitioning to an upgraded portfolio budgeting system. Our budgeting system,
which we call BORIS, had just gone through a major upgrade and we judged that
it was too risky to try in the short time frame to translate the information in
here. We would rather do it in a measured way. So we have alerted you to that.
What we plan to do in the additional estimates, the PAES, when we bring this
back in December or January, is show you how we have converted the old structure
into the new one, and the cross walk to explain that.[9]
18. The committee took
this opportunity to refer to the briefing from Defence officers held prior to
the hearings and suggested that a similar briefing would be helpful in light of
the proposed restructure. The intention of another briefing would be to enable committee
members to better 'track the outputs under the old system to the new system' in
order to gain some familiarity with it and not waste time at the next round of
estimates.[10]
A committee member also added that the next annual report would need to spell out
the changes using the same terms, so that committee members could 'easily move from the annual report
this year to the accounts for next year'.[11]
19. With regard to the
transition to the new structure, Defence informed the committee that it would be
obliged to report in the old structure for its Annual Report for financial year
2006–2007. In response to concerns about the contents of the Annual Report, a
Defence officer suggested:
What we can do in the new structure from 2007–08 onwards is show
it to you in the current structure and in the revised structure. We could brief
you on that before we have the hearing into the additional estimates.[12]
20. The committee
indicated that such a proposal would be welcomed.
21. The committee acknowledged the presence at
the hearings, of Mr Nick Warner, Secretary of the Department of Defence, and Air Chief Marshal, Angus Houston, AM,
Chief of Defence Force (CDF).[13]
Secretary's opening statement
22. Secretary of the Department of Defence, Mr Nick Warner,
informed the committee that the Defence Management Review report, along with Defence's
response, was released publicly on 5April 2007.
He stated that...
The report acknowledged the significant progress Defence has
made over the past decade in a range of areas, most notably in military
operations but also in policy development and a range of public sector reforms.
...
having acknowledged these achievements and successes, the review
team made a series of recommendations about how Defence can improve its
organisational efficiency and effectiveness. The report made 53
recommendations. The CDF and I, in consultation with the Defence service chiefs
and group heads, agreed to implement 50 of the recommendations in full and two
of the recommendations in part.
...
of the 50–plus recommendations we agreed, four key principles
will underpin our approach to implementation: accountability and governance,
support to our minister and government more broadly, people management and the
need to reform our business systems. Clearer and more streamlined governance
and accountability arrangements will assist us in maintaining a high
operational tempo while also driving organisational reform and planning for the
future.[14]
Chief of the Defence Force opening statement
23. Chief
of the Defence Force, Air Chief Marshal Houston, gave
the committee a comprehensive update on ADF operational achievements, and recruitment and
retention issues, since the additional estimates hearings in February 2007.
24.
Air Chief Marshal Houston
informed the committee that:
Firstly, in terms of our operations broadly, we continue to
maintain a busy tempo, with the government to date approving the overall
deployment of about 3,850 people to nine overseas operating locations in 2007.
We also have 450 personnel deployed on security tasks in our maritime
protection zone and other personnel deployed on international engagement,
including participation in exercises and foreign visits. Additionally, in
preparation for APEC 2007, a forward headquarters element has been established
in Sydney for liaison and coordination of Defence support to the APEC security
task force. Each of these deployments are within the capability of our forces,
are sustainable for the duration of the deployment and leaves us postured to
meet a range of contingency requirements.
... On our progress with recruiting and retention: As you are
aware, the ADF has been directed to grow to a full–time strength of 57,000 by
2016. Its current strength is about 51,000, so this represents an increase of
6,000, or just over 11.75 percent, in ten years. To do this, we have to
increase recruiting and improve retention. We have set ourselves a goal of
increasing our recruiting intake for our full–time force from 4,677 to 6,500
per annum and reducing our separation rate from just over 11 percent to
below 10per cent. We began looking at improving our recruiting in some
depth in 2005. Already we have seen marked and improved recruiting performance.
...
Our first initiatives looked at stabilising key ranks within
Army and Navy... [Within Navy] doctors, principal warfare officers, submarine
warfare officers, underwater medicine qualified sailors, submarine and junior
technical sailors are in particularly short supply, due in part to their
attractiveness to the private professional organisations and industry. ... But it
is not all bad and there are some encouraging signs that critical parts of our
Navy workforce are on the road to recovery.[15]
25. Other major topics examined during the hearing included:
Portfolio overview
-
Number of ADF personnel
deployed overseas; number of deployments and recruitment issues (pp.9–10).[16]
-
Improvised explosive device (IED) attacks (p.11, 14, 16).
-
Iraqi security forces training;
ethno–sectarian violence (pp.11–12,
14–16; 17).
-
Australia's long–term commitment in Iraq (pp.13–10).
-
Operation Fard–al–Qanun (pp.18–19).
-
Timetable for the withdrawal of
coalition forces (pp.19–20).
-
Case of Mr Hector Patino (pp.20–22; 61).
-
Afghanistan: increasing threat posed by the insurgency;
protection for the reconstruction task force
(p.22). Rotation of ADF personnel (pp. 23–24).
-
NATO and Afghanistan (pp.24–25).
-
HMAS Westralia (pp.27–44; 46).
-
Report on Defence
management review (Proust report) (pp.44–62;
77).
-
Security, storage and disposal of
weapons and munitions (pp.62–69).
Budget summary
-
Portfolio budget statements (PBS):
revised defence capability plan (pp.70–76).
-
Defence contract with Qantas Business Travel (pp.76–81).
-
Defence spending on advertising and associated matter in 2006–2007 (pp.81–85; 91).
-
PBS: revised outcome and output
structure (p.85).
-
PBS: Section 31 receipts (pp.9–10; 31May07, p.57). Saving and efficiency measures (pp. 87–89).
-
Comsuper: civilian compensation
claims and Comcare (pp.90–91;
31May07, p.57).
-
The Aboriginal Community
Assistance Program (ACAP) and the Cadet Enhancement Program (pp.92–94).
-
PBS: recruitment and retention (pp.95–96).
-
PBS: DMO maintenance
cycles (p.97).
Major capital facilities
-
Mulwala propellant manufacturing
plant; Mulwala redevelopment project (pp.98–100;
31May07, p.63).
-
RAAF base Pearce and capital works
(pp.100–101).
People—Defence personnel
-
ADF personnel record keeping (pp.102–103).
-
Length of overseas deployments (pp.9–10, 23–24; 103–106). Pre–and post–deployment psychological screening
and mental health issues (pp.106–110).
-
Signalman Geoff Gregg (31May07, pp.3–12; 44–54).
-
Suicide rates and discharges (31May07, pp.12–14; 15–16).
-
Defence Deployed Health Surveillance Program (31May07, pp.14–15).
-
Deployment allowances (31May07,
pp.17–18, 19–20; 57).
-
Amberley State School (31May07,
pp.20–24).
-
Recruitment and retention (31May07, pp.25–34). Special Forces Direct Recruiting Scheme (31May07, pp.55–56).
-
Tritium leaks at Bulimba Barracks (31May07, pp.34–37; 39–43). Contaminated compasses (31May07, pp.37–39).
-
ADF Drug policy for
contractors (31May07, pp.56–57).
-
Separation rates of women in ADF (31May07, pp.57).
Defence Materiel Organisation
-
Review process (31May07, pp.58–59).
-
Contract negotiations with Kaman (31May07, pp.60–63).
Outcome 1: Defence capabilities
-
Air combat capability gap; Super
Hornet program and F–111s (31May07,
pp.67–70).
-
Report: Joint operations for the
21st century (31May07,
pp.71–73).
Outcome 2: Navy
-
Australian Navy used in combating
whaling by Japanese in the Southern Ocean (31May07,
pp.73–75).
-
The Australian Antarctic Territory
economic exclusion zone (EEZ) (31May07,
pp.74–75).
Outcome 7: Superannuation and housing support services
-
Superannuation: proportioning rule
and its application to Defence Force superannuation benefits (31May07, pp.63–67).
Defence Housing Australia[17]
26.
The committee acknowledged the
presence at the hearings of Mr Richard Bear, General Manager, Development and Construction, and officers of Defence Housing
Australia.
27. Issues that were discussed included:
-
Defence Home Ownership Assistance Scheme (pp.76–80).
-
Staffing levels and roles in DHA (pp.80–81).
-
DHA budget and funding (p.81).
Department of Veterans’ Affairs[18]
28. The committee acknowledged the presence at
the hearings of Mr Mark Sullivan, Secretary, and officers of the Department of
Veterans’ Affairs.
29. Before commencing
the examination of officers from the Department of Veterans' Affairs, the Secretary of the Department expressed
concerns about the level of detail contained in questions about the personal
circumstances of Geoff Gregg during the estimates examination of Defence. He
indicated that he was not prepared to go into the 'some of the material that I
heard today in terms of citing the evidence from psychological reports and
chronologies'. He stated that he would be 'quite happy to go through the
processes, the policy issues and the procedural issues...'[19]
30. The committee
member indicated he had been advised that that the parents, widow and family
members had given their approval for questions to be asked. He indicated that
his intention was to ask questions on procedures and not go to questions
dealing with health details.
31. Issues that the committee examined included:
Outcome 1—Compensation
-
Signalman Geoff Gregg (pp.82–97; 106).
-
Writeway Research Service (pp.98–99).
-
Claims for disability pensions
from personnel returning from theatres of conflict (pp.99–100).
-
General rate pensions (pp.100, 102).
-
Staffing levels and overdue claims
(pp.102–103).
-
Suicide statistics and
compensation claims (pp.104–105). Mental health wellbeing forum (pp.105–106, 112).
-
Vietnam Veterans Health Study (pp.106–107).
Outcome 2—Health
-
Veterans' chaplaincy services (pp.107–109).
-
Nuclear test veterans and access
to the white card (pp.115–117).
-
Letter to special rate
intermediate pensioners (p.117).
-
Veterans home care service (pp.117–119).
Outcome 3—Commemorations
-
Hyde Park memorial in London (pp.112–113).
-
Memorials at Le Hamel and
Villers–Bretonneux in France (pp.113–115).
Output 6
-
Mr Desmond Kelly and the allegation of leaked sensitive information (pp.109–112).
Acknowledgements
32. The committee expresses its appreciation of the assistance
given during its hearings by Senator the Hon Chris Ellison and Senator the Hon Helen Coonan. The committee also acknowledges the attendance and
cooperation of the many departmental and agency officers and the services of
various parliamentary staff involved in the estimates process.
Senator
Marise Payne
Chair
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